how would i know if a fender squire is authentic

hey guys, im planning to buy a second hand squire jazz bass, how would i know if the product i'm getting is authentic?

Hi Jek, Start by checking the serial number, here is a basic guide for you, once having established the serial number, post it and we will tell you if its genuine. The following info will also help you determine if its a Fender Sqier number.

History
Fender, under the ownership of CBS, acquired the Squier brand name in 1965 when it bought a USA based string making firm, but it lay dormant for many years [1]. Before the Fender Squier series were introduced in 1982, Fender were making lower priced guitars such as the Fender Lead series at their Fullerton California plant. Until the introduction of the Fender Squier series, Fender had never produced lower priced guitars based on their main Stratocaster and Telecaster designs and had always used different model designs for their lower priced guitars.

In the late 1970s and early 1980s Fender was facing competition from lower priced Japanese made guitars. The lower priced Fender guitars were made in America and could not compete with the lower prices of Japanese made Fender copies. In the early 1980s, Japanese labor and production costs were much lower than in America and to compete with the Japanese made guitars, Fender moved the lower priced Fender guitar production from America to Japan.

Fender were also losing sales in Japan to Japanese guitar brands such as Tōkai, Greco and Fernandes, and the establishment of Fender Japan would benefit Fender sales in Japan as well as overseas. Fender began negotiations with several Japanese musical instrument distributors and reached an agreement with Yamano Gakki and Kanda Shokai to establish Fender Japan. Yamano Gakki are also known for once being part of Epiphone Japan. Kanda Shokai own the Greco brand name and one of the conditions of the Fender Japan agreement was that Kanda Shokai cease production of its own Greco Fender copies.

This arrangement benefited Fender because it removed the Greco Fender copies from the Japanese market which were selling in Japan at much lower prices than the American made Fenders and it also benefited Kanda Shokai because Kanda Shokai could then distribute Japanese made Fender branded guitars in Japan. Further negotiations between Fender and Japanese guitar factories were done. Tokai was seriously considered to start building the first Japanese made Fenders but after a breakdown in negotiations, FujiGen Gakki was chosen instead [2].

The first Squier series was launched on July/August 1982 and over time the Squier series has slowly evolved to include original model designs and production has moved from Japan to various other Asian countries such as Korea and China.

[edit] Initial Squier JV series
The first Fender Japan models introduced in May 1982, were the 1957 and 1962 series which were Fender Stratocaster models ST'57-115, ST'57-85, ST'57-65, ST'62-115, ST'62-85, ST'62-65 and the Precision Bass models PB'57-95, PB'57-70, PB'62-98, PB'62-75. These models were Fender models and not Squier models. They had Fender USA pickups installed and were made for the Japanese market only and not for export [1].

Fender soon added a less expensive export Squier series based on the Fender Japan 1957 and 1962 series in July/August 1982, which had a large Fender logo with a smaller Squier logo and had a zinc rather than a steel tremolo block and had Fender USA pickups installed. The Squier series were also made available for the Japanese market in October 1982, which incorporated small changes compared to the export Squier series. The large Fender logo of the export Squier series was soon changed to a large Squier logo.

The first Fender Japan guitars are known as the JV Fenders and JV Squiers, with JV standing for Japanese Vintage and were made by the FujiGen Gakki factory in Japan, using technical support from Fender USA. The SQ Squier series was introduced in late 1983/early 1984. The SQ Squier series was based more on 1970s Fender models and also had Japanese made pickups installed.

[edit] Serial number tracing
As follows is an approximate method in which Squier dates the serial numbers of manufactured instruments

[edit] Japanese Squiers
For Japanese Squier serial number dating, see Fender's serial number dating service. The Japanese MIJ (Made in Japan) Squiers were made by FujiGen up to 1997 and the Japanese CIJ (Crafted in Japan) Squiers were made by Tokai and Dyna from 1997.

[edit] Mexican Squiers
MN: M = Mexico, N = Nineties (1990s), the first number following the serial number prefix is the year.

For example

"MN8" indicates that it was made at Ensenada, Mexico in 1998.
[edit] USA Squiers
Fender did not make many Squiers in the USA. Some USA made Squiers have a serial number with a E = Eighties (1980s) prefix, and some have a serial number with a N = Nineties (1990s) prefix. Some USA made Squiers also had a 000XXX serial stamp on the neckplate with no letter prefix and no serial number on the headstock.

USA Squiers were made for less than a year spanning 1989 and 1990 before production of Squiers went back to Mexico.

[edit] Korean Squiers
CN/VN: C = Cor-Tek (Cort), V = Saehan(Sunghan), S was already taken by Samick so Saehan(Sunghan) used V instead (Saehan(Sunghan) made the Vester guitars), N = Nineties (1990s), the first number following the serial number prefix is the year.

For example

"CN5" = made by Cor-Tek (Cort) in 1995.
"VN5" = made by Saehan(Sunghan) in 1995.
KC/KV: KC (Korean Cor-Tek (Cort)) and KV (Korean Saehan(Sunghan)), the serial number prefix is followed by a 2 number year.

For example

"KC97" = made by Cor-Tek (Cort) in 1997.
"KV97" = made by Saehan(Sunghan) in 1997.
KC and KV serial number prefixes are usually used on Crafted in Korea Squiers.

S/E: The S and E serial number prefix Korean Squiers are from the late 1980s/early 1990s. S = Samick, E = Young Chang, E letter serial numbers were used on Young Chang's Fenix brand guitars [3]. The first number following the serial number prefix is the year.

For example

"S9" = made by Samick in 1989.
"E0" = made by Sung-Eum in 1990.
"E1" = made by Sung-Eum in 1991.
There were also Korean Squier serials with no serial number prefix and 6 or 7 numbers and the first number is the year.

[edit] Chinese & Taiwanese Squiers
YN: Y = Yako (Taiwan), N = Nineties (1990s), the first number following the serial number prefix is the year.

For example

"YN5" = made by Yako in 1995.
CY: C = China, Y = Yako (Taiwan), the serial number prefix is followed by a 2 number year.

For example

"CY97" = made by Yako in 1997.
CY serials are usually used on Crafted in China Squiers. Some Chinese made Gretsch guitars also have a CY serial number.

Miscellaneous Chinese serials: CD, CT, CJ, NC: C = China, the first number following the serial number prefix is the year. Probably made by Yako (Taiwan).

Some Squiers that are sold only in the Chinese and Asian markets are made by Axl in China.

[edit] Indonesian Squiers
IC: I = Indonesia, C = Cor-Tek (Cort), the serial number prefix is followed by a 2 number year.

IS: I = Indonesia, S = Samick, the serial number prefix is followed by a 2 number year.

[edit] Indian Squiers
Some Squier IIs were made in India around 1989-1990, as well as some more recent Squiers, including the Vintage Modified series (serial numbers starting with SH), introduced in 2007.

[edit] References
^ Fender Squier History
^ Fender Japan History
^ Blue Book Of Electric Guitars 9th Edition Zachary Fjestad, Edited by S.P. Fjestad ISBN 1886768579


Fenderphil

Hi,

i'm French
(my English is poor but I am going to try to explain you my problem).

I have a Squier Stratocaster since about 1991, it has the white body and the clear wooden handle.
I have never found any other number than on the head of the handle. And this number is following "M2036509".
I found on Internet a person who sold an Squier Télécaster with a similar serial number and an identical year of purchase.
http://cardiff.gumtree.com/cardiff/35/44428435.html

But it does not move forward me the more, the more one be able to read on certain sites the same type of thing which you posted :

There were also Korean Squier serials with no serial number prefix and 6 or 7 numbers and the first number is the year.

But it does not say about it more on this series "M XXXXXXX " to be known if they are good guitars and good manufacture...
If you know about it more and if you could say me about it more as for this series it shall help me tremendously.
beforehand thank you.

HI ... I cannot find the prefix 'sq'... I have a SQ09701... do you know when my 'baby' was born?
thanx

Hi There, Here is the info for your Ax.

Guitar Info
Your guitar was made at the
Fuji-gen Plant (for Fender Japan), Japan
in the Year(s): 1985 - 1986


Fuji String Instrument Production Corporation

Fuji String Instrument Production Corporation was opened in may 1960, they initially started manufacturing violins and quickly switched to classical guitar production. In 1962 electric guitar construction was started. Fujigen has a reputation for excellent quality and craftsmanship so the guitars they produce are highly regarded. They produce guitars via OEM for famous brands such as Ibanez, Epiphone, Yamaha and Fender (the import Special Interest Group nature model), G&L and others.


Regards Fenderphil

hi there

i want to buy a squier strat with the SN# M 2001401 made in korea. Does anybody know from which year this guitar is? i was already looking for it but I couldn't find anything about it.

mkay

fenderphil wrote:

Hi There, Here is the info for your Ax.

Guitar Info
Your guitar was made at the
Fuji-gen Plant (for Fender Japan), Japan
in the Year(s): 1985 - 1986

Whoops that doesn't jive....
Actually that guitar was likely built in late 83. This is a very early SQ serial and I would bet it has split post sealed tuners. SQ serial guitars were only built for about a year from late 83 - late 84. Incidentally, the export SQ's are almost always the so-called 70's Re-issue (because of the big headstock&3bolt neckplate) but they are more of an "upgrade" than a re-issue. Different neck profile, tremolo, 3bolt method,tuners and a "62" pickguard. Many different styled SQ serial Squiers were made for the Japanese market along with custom-order and the Bullet "1" series.

Hi There, I wouldn't know personally, but that is what Fender dating site gave as the info against that guitar serial number so I would take it up with them. Hopefully, they know what they made and when. Also if you are sure about the details you gave and already knew, why did you ask the question in the first place.???????????????????


Fenderphil

fenderphil wrote:

Hi There, I wouldn't know personally, but that is what Fender dating site gave as the info against that guitar serial number so I would take it up with them. Hopefully, they know what they made and when. Also if you are sure about the details you gave and already knew, why did you ask the question in the first place.???????????????????
Fenderphil

I think your mixing me up with the guy who asked the question. I was questioning your answer about the SQ serial. As for your comment about Fenders own knowledge and their dating site..the dating of Japanese and especially Korean guitars is not cut&dry. Long time fans like those who made 21frets.com will confirm that there are many anomalies when it comes to dating Japanese guitars. Fender does not help much either with vague dating such as 84-87 to cover Japan E-serials or having no info such as the Mxx.. Korean asked about in this topic.

mkay wrote:

hi there
i want to buy a squier strat with the SN# M 2001401 made in korea. Does anybody know from which year this guitar is? i was already looking for it but I couldn't find anything about it.
mkay

Back to topic.. the M1 M2 serials can be dated to approx 91, 92 because they are used on some Squier II models, which were built at that time. Check Ebay Item number: 260177045690 for an example.

Yes I am well aware of that....I've been playing for over 50 years 45/6 as a pro. Thats why I said check with Fender, if they don't know then nobody else is going to hey? Apologies, if I mixed you up with someone else...It can happen when you get senile ha ha.

Regards Fenderphil

Hi , I bought this one (SQ09701) in Belgium. I have it since 1989 (wow... that's 20 years now... how time flies). But when it was made for the japanese market... how did it end up in Belgium ?
Greets, R.

Hi River, No different than a US made guitar being in Australia... Although the Japanese made certain models they were not just for the Japanese market but wordwide market.Dealers could draw stock from anywhere they chose...Of course why guitars are made at certain locations are primarily for reason of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Wherever the profit margin is greater due to labour etc etc thats where you will find a lot of things being made, in today's market China and Korea are examples.

Regards Fenderphil

I believe SQ(serial)70's style models and Squier JV models were both export to Europe and domestic market. The early Fender "Squier Series" label was export. Many early Squiers were sold in Canada. "Fender" logo JV were "intended" for domestic Japanese market. In 1982 the US budget lines were the Fender Bullet, Fender Lead, Bronco Bass etc. Also there were many SQ custom order models and the "Contemporary" models made for domestic Japan.

Note: The 21frets.com site appears to be gone... too bad because those guys had done a lot of research on the JV and SQ history. Here is a couple of links with some info/rumors/stories...
http://www.japanguitars.co.uk/Page%201%20history.html
http://www.music-trade.co.jp/Fenderjapanserial.html

Thanks for the information here... I've had many of my questions answered by others who posted here.

I would like to know more about the hardware on my Fender Squire II SN: S932421. I purchased this all pearl white Fender in Tampa FLorida around Christmas 1989. This axe has a "humbucker," bridge pick up. But, is this an Atomic Humbucking Pick Up? The tuning machines do not have the "f" labeling on them. Is it still authentic? This axe doesn't have the out-put jack on the face it's on the lower edge of the body. It's been very hard to find this model information. I'm planning to replace the tuning machines because the top tuner bent when I dropped it on the head.

Hi Darce, According to the serial number this guitar was made :

Your guitar was made at the
Fuji-gen Plant (for Fender Japan), Japan
in the Year(s): 1994 - 1995

Fuji String Instrument Production Corporation was opened in may 1960, they initially started manufacturing violins and quickly switched to classical guitar production. In 1962 electric guitar construction was started. Fujigen has a reputation for excellent quality and craftsmanship so the guitars they produce are highly regarded. They produce guitars via OEM for famous brands such as Ibanez, Epiphone, Yamaha and Fender (the import Special Interest Group nature model), G&L and others.


Here are a couple of tips for you. The US pickups fitted to Strats and Teles have cloth covered wire back to the pots. So, as far as Strats and Teles are concerned, plastic covered wire equals Japanese, cloth covered wire equals US. Also, Strat pick-guards loaded with Texas Specials have a red circular sticker on the underside. Those loaded with US Vintage pups do not.

You may like to check out the "New" made in Japan" Strat site at this location.

http://freespace.virgin.net/john.blackman4/index.htm
Regards Fenderphil

b]Darce wrote:[/b]

(SNIPPED)
I would like to know more about the hardware on my Fender Squire II SN: S932421. I purchased this all pearl white Fender in Tampa FLorida around Christmas 1989. This axe has a "humbucker," bridge pick up. But, is this an Atomic Humbucking Pick Up? The tuning machines do not have the "f" labeling on them. Is it still authentic? This axe doesn't have the out-put jack on the face it's on the lower edge of the body. It's been very hard to find this model information. I'm planning to replace the tuning machines because the top tuner bent when I dropped it on the head.

Sorry FenderPhil, I don't mean to keep contradicting you... Darce, your Squier II was made in Korea at the (S) Samick factory in 89 or 90. Many Squier II models were of the no-pickguard, HSS type. They generally have lower end ceramic pickups (not atomic HB ) and cheaper covered tuners (not sealed/diecast). Also of note, many of these have no "made in Korea" on them so they are incorrectly described as being made in the US in 79 by their owner/sellers as you can see in this thread.. http://www.axecentral.com/how-rare-is-american-made- squier-ii-stratn021718-it-plays-g...- 10122112.html#101221

fenderphil wrote:

Here are a couple of tips for you. The US pickups fitted to Strats and Teles have cloth covered wire back to the pots. So, as far as Strats and Teles are concerned, plastic covered wire equals Japanese, cloth covered wire equals US.

In vintage JV guitars this appears to be consistant for the US made black-bobbin pickups but the now coveted red or grey "bottoms" can have plastic as well.

This Squire II does have the Made in Korea printed above the SN. I'm sure I purchased this in 89 because I have the receipt.

Does the size of the peghead holes give any indication of the quality of the machine Korea used? I found during my upgrate to modern machines (Mr. Gearhead PN: 0992040000) that the peghead holes are smaller than the replacements require. On another note - what is the size of the peghead hole needed for the new tuners?

Made in Korea wrote:

This Squire II does have the Made in Korea printed above the SN. I'm sure I purchased this in 89 because I have the receipt.

Does the size of the peghead holes give any indication of the quality of the machine Korea used? I found during my upgrate to modern machines (Mr. Gearhead PN: 0992040000) that the peghead holes are smaller than the replacements require. On another note - what is the size of the peghead hole needed for the new tuners?

No. The covered Korean tuners like these..
have the same size holes as Kluson tuners. You can also find modern covered tuners with a similar cover that will (closely) match the screw pattern and some also have a tension screw on the button which is best. Or you can use Klusons or you can ream out the holes for modern sealed ones

Here's a modern type

Ok I've reamed out the hole to fit the new machine. They are working out great. Thank for the help. Rightnow I'm working on intonation. The neck looks straight and after tightening up the bridge tention there is no fret ringing.

So, just jumping in here.
I have a Squire SQ 06441, I bought in new in 84, if i remember correctly. I have the receipt somewhere, can't remember if it was $199, or $249?

Any idea of the range in current value? I know, it depends on condition, retail/trade, etc. etc., I'm just wondering.

That's an early release with the zero after the SQ. I would guess it has split post tuners. Based on my exp wiyh ebay sales, SQ strats are selling from 250-400 by auction. The auction prices on all these older Squiers has tamed over the last 4 months. Last spring they were up im the 350 - 500 range. Since then a lot of big sellers want 5-700 for their buyitnow prices! Older Squiers have become more popular over the last couple of years. The JV and SQ models are well built and can be nice guitars but most still need some work, especially the frets.
Incidentally, those same big sellers are trying to push the price of the Korean 90's squiers. While their are some good early ones from late 88-90, most sport ply bodies, cheap bridge&tuners and bland ceramic pickups but..they have nice necks for project use.

Thanks for the response and info on what they're going for in price. I'm not planning on selling it, but I might insure it now.

It does have the split-post tuners. The body has some wear and tear from a lot of college band gigs in basements and and bars. I did have some fret work done once, after I had a made a permanent D-chord impression. And I had to replace the pickup switch long ago.

I've thought about upgrading the pickups, not sure if it would be easier just to replace the whole pickguard-pickups-volume-tone knobs, at once? My soldering skills aren't that great.

I once borrowed a friends new American Fender Strat, probably in '88, and did a side by side comparison. My friends strat just had more tone. it wasn't just volume, there was a fuller sound. (What did Gilmour use on the Comfortably Numb solo? Anyone know?)

Thanks again.

First off, don't separate any parts except the input wire. Keep the original stuff as original as possible. Based on the tone you describe you want, you might want to try playing through a compressor or try a loaded cheapo pickguard with ceramic pickups ,swap the parts and put all tour original stuff on the new guard for storage/testing. The pickguard on your guitar will be the "62" style with the pickguard screw at the center of the bridge&mid pickups. Whatever pickguard you get will line up with at least 2 holes if you want to do quick swap for comparison.
Ceramic pickups are the ones with magnets on the bottom. Yours are made up of 6 cyl. alnico mags. Ceramic pickups ..to my ear..have a different dynamic range of response to the your pick attack. Alnico p/u besides (IMHO) sounding warmer and cleaner are very sensitive to how hard or soft you pluck the string. The harder you attack, the more they give ya. Ceramic seem to respond more and give a fatter compressed-like output. That is good for light pickers, shredders, and novice players because even a barely hit note will be heard. On the other hand, I'm more on the slow bluesy type, and like to get a lot of melody out of one note through bending and using different pick attack which is more suited to alnicos although I will use some compression.
You can pick one up on ebay for about $25 shpped. The magnet size affects the response more than the number of windings (output). If you like the sound then you can upgrade to high end ceramics without disturbing the original parts.

Comfortably numb..no but he too plays bluesy with lot's of pickwork on 1 note. The sound he gets on that track is needs lot's of echo and compression..lot's!

So nobody knows where/when the M******* comes from?

Thanks for all the awesome detailed info on pickups!

My thought was to keep the original pickguard-pickups-knobs, etc. all intact and experiment with dropping in a loaded pick-guard. I did replace the 5-way switch about 15 years ago with a regular (?) strat switch. The little plastic knob didn't fit on the new switch, tho' I might still have it.

I guess I just want to get a fuller tone, without buying another guitar if I can. I have a Ric (jangly, but kinda thin) and a Les Paul copy (what looks like PAF humbuckers, but kinda noisey, it's a Hondo circa 1982)

Thanks again.